Travis Barker on Surviving a Plane Crash, Miscarriage and Parenting Famous Kids

Once in a whereas I’ll put on a flannel or one thing if I really feel like I need to be presentable. I’m coming to “New York Times Podcast.” I don’t need to —

You don’t bought to decorate up.

I don’t need to appear to be a bum.

That’s all proper. Honestly, we’re —

But I’m additionally like —

Some folks may go extra bummy, and then some folks may go nicer. It relies upon on —

I feel I’m proper within the center.

[INTERPOSING VOICES]

This is nice.

[MUSIC PLAYING]

Welcome to the “New York Times Podcast,” your repair your face of weekly tradition chat. I’m Jon Caramanica, and I’m the critic.

I’m Joe Coscarelli, and I’m the reporter.

And I’m Travis Barker, and I’m on “Popcast.”

Yes, Mr. Baren Von Tito himself within the constructing.

Yeah.

Travis Barker wants no introduction. He is the drummer of our lifetime, I feel.

I might agree.

Travis Barker is right here right now to speak with us about his total profession, from the Aquabats and Blink 182 by means of being essentially the most in-demand drummer in rap music and past. Travis additionally has a new documentary coming to Hulu August 13 referred to as “Louder Than Fear,” which traces his life from delivery until right now. It was shot over the span of 10 years, starting in 2017, and focuses intensely on the harrowing airplane crash that he survived and many others didn’t. Thanks for being with us.

Yeah, thanks for having me.

I actually respect it. I simply needed to start out by naming a couple artists. And, Jon, you’ll be able to inform me what all of them have in frequent. Dwight Yoakam, Paul Wall, Young Dro, Avril Lavigne, Suicide Boys, Post Malone, and Animal from The Muppets.

Besides all showing on numerous “best end of year” lists that I’ve put out over the time, they’re all Travis Barker collaborators.

Whoa, very cool.

They’re Travis Barker collaborators. And I’ll say, going again to the 2000s, seeing your identify pop up with somebody sudden had this form of twin impact on me. On the one hand, there’s this form of spark of pleasure. Like, hey, one thing that hasn’t occurred earlier than goes to occur right here. But it additionally, I believed, stated a lot in regards to the individuals who invited you into their areas and stated that they have been open-minded by their willingness to have you ever come within the room and possibly destabilize what they ordinarily did. Tell me in regards to the conversations if you would go into a room with a well-known rapper who possibly hadn’t labored with somebody such as you earlier than. What have been they asking of you, and what have been you providing to them?

I imply, it’s exhausting to say why they picked me. I feel it’s the identical factor that form of sparks a relationship, or if you first discuss to somebody or meet somebody. I used to be seeing what they have been doing of their style. And I actually dug it. And I feel vice versa for them. Wayne can be a good instance, who would come to me and say, yo, I bought tattooed due to you. You know?

He stated that to you, Lil Wayne?

Yeah, I dressed like this due to you. I used to be impressed by you. And then I’m like, wait, I’m impressed by you.

Yeah, positive.

I bear in mind I used to be with Blink across the “Dude Ranch” period. And we have been in Vegas enjoying one thing collectively. And I noticed the Hot Boys. They have been enjoying proper after us, or earlier than. I don’t know the order. But I simply see Wayne and Juvy and everybody simply on the brink of go on stage. And I wasn’t actually inquisitive about watching no matter rock band was enjoying after us or earlier than us. I used to be like, Hot Boys are about to go on. This is unbelievable.

I by no means bought to see the Hot Boys. I’m jealous.

I really feel such as you’re taking a look at folks which are in possibly one other style than you. And you’re impressed by them. And that normally sparked a collaboration of some kind.

I used to be struck. In the documentary, one thing I didn’t know was that your first actual hip hop collaboration, or with a rapper, was with Bun B on the “Trill” album. Bun B, an previous pal of mine. Tell me about Bun and Pimp reaching out to you to try this work.

Yeah, that was the primary rap beat I ever made, proper? There was different collaborations earlier than that. It was so random. I used to be on tour and Puff had reached out and was like, we wish you on this track with G. Dep and simply need you to come back be within the video. This is loopy. Like, why is Puff calling me? Whatever. This is so random.

I imply, you’re within the “Bad Boy For Life” video, which It possibly isn’t as cool right now because it was on the time, however —

Yeah, after all. ^P. DIDDY, “BAD BOYS FOR

We still here

You’re rocking with the best

Don’t worry if I write rhymes

I write checks

But we’re not talking about that. We’re just talking about my first — yeah, hip hop reaching out to me. It was like him. It was like Method Man reached out to me to do something, like some strip club documentary. He was doing just the most random things. But I think around the time of the first “Transplants” album, Skinhead Rob hit me. And he’s like, yo Bun wants a beat for his solo undertaking.

And I was like, man, I play the drums, Rob. I don’t really make beats. He’s like, you do now, motherfucker. Whatever. And now I’m like, yeah, when Bun B asks you for a beat, and he needs another song for his album, I’m like, of course. I’ll do whatever. If you listen to that song, I wasn’t programming. I didn’t have an MPC. I didn’t have a SP-1200. It’s all live. It’s all live percussion, using percussion that sounds like hand claps, a lot of shakers, a lot of cabasa.

I’m interested in this crossover between punk and rap because that’s where I come from. I grew up in Florida, in the South. These things were in dialogue with each other. You growing up in the skate and stoner culture of San Bernardino County, California, talk to me about how hip hop and punk were interplaying at that time before it was happening in the mainstream.

Well, skateboarding taught me everything. Skate videos had punk rock music, thrash music, rap music, everything. If you watched a H Street video, you were educated on cool.

[H.STREET, “SHACKLE ME NOT”]

Right.

You know, whether it was like Operation Ivy song, or — you were kind of learning about music. It was like music discovery. Skateboarding also just taught everyone how to dress and everything. Just like, it was my compass to everything I grew up loving that I still haven’t grown out of.

Totally. At the same time, you were in the marching band. you were playing jazz music. How did those two sides of yourself, the anti-establishment stuff, smoking weed and making skate videos, interplay with the rigor of having to learn drums, especially in a jazz or marching band context?

It was my only opportunity to play, really. It was cool to go out and skate every day and have a dream of being a pro skater. But I really would use my drumming to go and get a free pass to go skate the older kids in my neighborhood’s ramp. And sometimes they’d be like, you can’t come skate it until you play “Injustice For All” from front to back.

[METALLICA, “…AND JUSTICE FOR ALL”]

So I’d go home, and I’d learn “Injustice For All.” And I’d come back. So I would pay my dues so I could go skate the ramp. So stuff like that. And then —

It was your entryway into rooms.

Yeah, it was my entryway into going and doing something that I loved, which was skateboarding. Wasn’t nearly as good as skateboarding than I was drumming. One of my close friends around that same time had said, yo, you’re way better at drumming than you are skateboarding.

You’re just like, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. So that was cool. And I knew, OK, skateboarding was still a thing I could do, but I’m not going to be a pro skater.

No stress.

I grew up in Fontana. Blue collar. Like, my dad built our house with his own two hands. Low-income family. We didn’t have a bunch. Jazz band and marching band was it. That was all that was really there for me, besides playing in my bedroom.

You’re supposed to do a summer camp before you can even try out for marching band. But I had a rough summer. Like, that’s the summer my mom passed away. So I just showed up the day of school and tried out without doing all the preparation that everyone else did. And I still made second or third chair marching band, which was cool.

Was it clear to everyone around you at the time that you were special on the drums? Did you feel them feeling it in real time?

Yeah, I feel like the kids I grew up playing drums with were always very supportive and would pick my brain. But I also did practice hours a day. My parents, no one was musically gifted or played any instruments. But my dad was in the military, fought in Vietnam, rode a Harley, and was a steel mill worker. So I bounced quarters off my bed. And if he was going to buy me a drum kit, I needed to practice hours a day before I’d go out and skate or ride bikes. So, yeah, because of that, I feel like I practiced a lot. And that’s why maybe I was a little ahead of whoever else I was in school with.

There’s a rigor in heavy metal drumming, and then there’s a rigor in jazz and marching band drumming. And a lot of times people don’t think of those as in conversation with each other. How did you think of those two styles talking to each other? Like, was it novel that you could bring the practice and the rigor of marching band and jazz into essentially a metal or a punk environment?

My dad and mom put me in some drum lessons, like some drum instruction, where I learned how to read. Spent a lot of time reading music, reading jazz charts. Both my mom and my dad had it set like, he’s going to be a drummer. He’s going to be a musician. And that was the stuff I had to practice because I needed to show up, whatever, every two weeks, and know what I was doing.

You couldn’t go to any of those instructors and say, hey, I want to learn Metallica. I want to learn Sepultura. I want to learn DRI. They’re going to be like, what? This isn’t even music. So that was the stuff that I would just challenge myself with. Or, thankfully, the kids in my neighborhood who would challenge me like, hey, you got to learn this.

And you’d learn it by ear. You just learned it by ear.

Yeah, I would just learn it, just sit there and play along with records. And I had a lot of that. Even my sisters, they’d play Michael Jackson records or Stacy Q, whatever they were listening to at the time. And I would learn —

“Two of Hearts“.

yeah — Beastie Boys. And I would learn all the drum parts on “Paul’s Boutique,” which have been all programmed.

Right. that’s like, you’re not supposed to be able to drum that.

That’s a crazy record to learn how to play.

Yeah. Hey, ladies, with all the fast fills —

I mean. It was almost punk rock tempos. So I would learn all that stuff, too. It was just anything I kind of would zone in and try to learn it and get as good as I could.

One of the big through lines of the documentary is the physical toll that your life and career have put on your body, but specifically drumming and the physicality with which you drum, the aggression. I think anybody who’s been listening to music since the mid-90s can identify you on a track, because there’s a certain speed and ferocity to it, and a sound that you’ve honed of your own.

When you think about the battle wounds that you’ve had from music, just looking at your fingers, and you’re seeing the scars, the calluses, does that feel all worth it to you, what you’ve put your body through?

Yeah, I think scars are cool.

I never leave a show and my hands are bloody.

I was just going to say, how are your hands right now?

They’re good right now. I mean, I have a couple nails I’ve busted that are just, like, destroyed. But, no, I’ve never left a show where I’m a bloody mess or my hands are a mess and be like, ah, I wish I didn’t play the way I did, or I wish I would have went not as hard tonight. Have you guys ever watched an MMA fight or a boxing fight where someone gases out the first round because technique has been thrown out the window and they’re just going for broke?

Pure adrenaline.

So I’ve learned how to do that, but I don’t gas out. And that’s why I train. And that’s why I run. And that’s why I box. And that’s why I do the things I do, because I want to be able to play the way I want to play.

Yeah. When did you make the connection between the physicality of your drumming and running marathons and working out with the intensity that you do? Like, when did you start to see those things as linked.

When I got tired. [LAUGHS] The first time I got tired. Anytime you’re out there and you think of something you want to do and you physically can’t do it because your skill level is not there, or you don’t have the stamina or the endurance, that’s a problem. I never want to be there. To not gas out and not get tired, I need to run or box or sprints. And those were all things also I replaced bad habits with when I got sober.

Yeah. I wonder, how much were you taking care of your body when you were really in the rock star years? Obviously, there were parts of it that you were not taking care of — you were taking pills, or whatever it was, staying out late, drinking. But were you also cognizant then that your body was your instrument?

Yeah. I was so good. I was so functioning, where I would wake up, smoke a blunt, eat, smoke another blunt, go on a six-mile run, come back, smoke a couple cigarettes, smoke another blunt. I was completely functioning. I was doing everything I do now, but maybe not as much. That balance. I would find that balance. But that’s what helped like teeter totter into the right direction.

Because you already had the germs of it.

Yeah. It was already there.

Early on, you’re in Feeble. Then you joined the Aquabats. And these are bands that have a very specific home. Aquabats is living in the ska universe. And the drumming for each of those styles is not the same. Obviously, you have a versatile training coming from jazz and marching band. Did you feel hemmed in by those styles? Was there a sort of sense of, damn, I can’t do everything I know I can do if we’re living in this box musically, if we’re living under this umbrella in a genre? Were you mindful of that back in the ‘90s?

It’s so funny you say that. That’s a lesson every musician has to learn because so many times I’ll be in the studio with an artist or a band, and I find the musicians trying to put everything they know, or everything in their skill set, into one song.

Right. You’re overcompensating in a way.

It’s unnecessary. Yeah, yeah. And that’s why you start side projects or you get into other bands. But, yeah, around the time I was in Feeble, I was also playing in a soca band in Laguna Beach, where – there’s a steel drummer. And I was playing drum kit. So I was really doing anything —

Where are those records?

Yeah. — just to get experience. We didn’t make any records. But, yeah, so around that time in Feeble, I was playing really, really fast, punk rock drumming. [MUSIC PLAYING]

Aquabats was such a fun project because there was so many styles of music within. Christian was into Devo. But then he’s into mariachi music. He also grew up skating and listening to just rad hardcore and punk rock bands. So that was, stylistically, really fun because it wasn’t boxed in.

Blink was a little bit more in the box. But I also had so much freedom because Tom and Mark would just be playing chugs, or really something — or a riff that was very linear and simple. And Tom would go, do that crazy shit you do. And that means, play a weird Latin beat over this. And it suddenly becomes a signature drum part.

Yeah. Talk about a specific Blink song that has a drum part that most people don’t get. Anything come to mind? I always thought it was cool when Dave Grohl talks about how “Smells Like Teen Spirit” is just ripped off of disco. You know what I mean? Like, something like that. And only maybe drummers who are really tuned in know.

“Dysentery Gary,” I think it’s the pre-choruses. It goes into Latin world.

Yeah.

[BLINK 182, “DYSENTERY GARY”]

That’s why playing jazz and playing in marching band and having a drum instructor make me play Latin patterns, where I independently do something different with my left hand and whatever else — that’s where that — it just blessed me with different ways to approach punk rock or whatever music I was playing in my own unique fashion that became my signature.

The sort of magic trick of your career is that you’ve been the guy in the background, but you’ve been the main attraction. And that’s very rare for a drummer. There’s only a handful throughout history who I think people came to see the drummer, or the drummer is the most famous guy in the band. When did you first start to get a taste for the spotlight, even though you were behind the lights?

I imply, by no means.

Is that true?

No. I mean, that’s not why I was ever there. It’s kind of weird. I guess the best way to describe it, it was very humble beginnings with very reachable goals. Right? When I left Fontana, my only goal was to be able to have somewhere to sleep, food to eat, and I could play my drums. If I could somehow make a living just playing drums, or even before that, just having a job where I could play drums and do all the stuff I loved, I was really happy. I was sort of head down, work mode. And just always — I was so passionate about what I did.

Less of chasing fame and more of at the show, you had to know eyes were on you instead of — typically, they’re on the lead singer. When did you start to feel that even though the drummer, typically a background role, that the eyes were on you? And did you like that feeling?

I don’t know. I don’t think I thought like that. Or I don’t even think I acknowledged that. I was always the quietest one in the band with Blink.

Right. Those are loud, goofy guys, Mark and Tom.

A lot of the Times because a lot of the banter was really funny. And I love Mark and Tom. And it’s similar to the banter that I had growing up skateboarding with my friends or playing in bands. It was almost a skit in between songs. It’s absolutely a skit in between songs.

The live albums are comedy albums.

It’s just classic Blink, right? But I wasn’t ever going to do anything that didn’t feel authentic to me or was out of character for me. When I first joined Blink, it was like, these guys are going to have fun and go crazy. And I need to keep time. And I need to kick ass. And that’s it.

But you also join Blink, literally, just as things are about to go absolute wild. The question I was going to ask is coming at this subject from a different side, which is, if you think back to the early blink videos, you’re as much of a character in those videos as Mark and Tom.

[BLINK-182, “ALL THE SMALL THINGS”]

It’s not like, these are the guys who sing, and then you’re just in the back kind of being like, I’m going to keep time. Even going back to the Aquabats, dressing up in the costume and being part of that, did you think of that — once you’re out of the punk universe, were you just like, well, I guess if I’m going to be in a big band, I also have to be a person that people visually recognized as part of the deal?

I wasn’t ready for any of it.

Yeah. They were just like, do this. And you’re like, cool, I’ll do it.

In Aquabats, Feeble was playing a show with BHR. And Chad from the Aquabats was in BHR. Both Aquabats and Blink, very similar story. Chad says to me, hey, you should come play with my other band. I think we need a drummer. A week later, I’m playing with the Aquabats.

I had no idea they wore costumes. I thought the album cover was just the album cover. And Christian hands me this costume. And I was like, oh, you got to be kidding me. I got to wear this?

I like when the doc — you’re like, my friends from home are going to roast me.

Yeah, I was getting heckled so bad. But it was fun. I’m also, I think, good at adapting and just pivoting and doing whatever. And then in Blink might be the symptom of also being a three-piece, where there is so much attention in all three members. But honestly, same thing happened.

We’re on tour with Aquabats. Their drummer takes off about 45 minutes before the show. They were going to have to cancel the show. I learned the set in 45 minutes, went and played a show with them. It was so fun. And then about a few days later, after the tour, they said, we want you to be in our band. We just want to keep playing with you. We don’t want to go backwards from here.

But long story short, I think, yeah, I was ready to go and play drums in that band. And I could kill it. And I was confident. I knew all the parts. And I loved the songs.

Did I think I was capable of being in videos, dressing up?

The third comedian in the band.

Yeah, running around naked for “What’s My Age Again.” I had no idea any of that shit was going to happen.

You embraced it.

You pop up in “American Pie.” On “CSI,” you have a cameo. You were very early to be a musician on reality television. And I think this increasing comfort that you had with being in front of the camera leads us to how vulnerable and real and intense this documentary is. What was it like to start putting yourself out there without the drums?

If you mean like, “Meet the Barkers,” or something like that, it was actually pretty easy because Jesse Ignjatovic, who produced that show, and he did “Diary,” , he was like a close friend just from us always visiting MTV and doing stuff at MTV. And he had just said one time, it would be so cool to do something with your family. And I kind of realized it would just be like this.

Cameras are up, but I’m not acting different. There’s no script I got to follow. It was kind of scary because we felt so comfortable. Right?

Because it was that early reality TV.

It was so early. So you didn’t know to be self-conscious because it’s so early in the whole arc of reality television.

Yeah. And it was so true reality. When I tell you there was 20 cameras set up in our house that you wouldn’t even realize are there —

Like below-deck style now. That’s how they do it. Yeah.

It’s like a crew of people living with you that stay in a house outside. And I was high all the fucking time. Yeah. We would go to the shooting range. All of our cameramen would be shooting with us too, at the shooting range. It was just, everywhere we went, whatever we did, it didn’t feel like we were filming.

They were extended family by that point.

Yeah.

When did you decide to make this film, and why?

I mean, after my book, the conversations started.

Sure. And that’s 10 years old at this point.

I read a bunch of this over the last week. So many good stories in here. What I liked about this was it’s not just your words. It’s also oral history style. It’s bringing in perspectives from bandmates, family members, friends. It really thickens up the story. So it’s a good way to do a book like this.

When I did that book, it was shortly after my accident. And I was also sober for the first time in I don’t know how many years. 20 years, something. It was humiliating, but it was also so real to have everyone tell their side of the story. Yeah.

It’s one thing to put those things on the page, but it’s another to relive them through archival video and photographs, the very intense footage in this movie from your plane crash, from your 20-plus surgeries after, your recovery period, very intimate moments with your family. Did you sit down and go through all that stuff before it was assembled in the film and think about what you were comfortable revisiting and including?

I mean, both the book and the film are therapeutic, right? The book, the wounds were so fresh. That was really hard. That was really difficult to write and sit with my co-writer on that.

The documentary, no, because I didn’t make the documentary or edit the documentary or anything like that. I would just see things that they would show me. And interesting fact about the documentary is it was maybe like 2017, or something around that time, the documentary was supposed to be done.

Really?

Right? Yeah.

It was like a rush job.

The documentary was done. It was the beginning of my life, my childhood, up until the time of the plane crash. And the directors and the producer of the film, their goal for the end of the film was, can you please go to an airport? Or can you please walk on a plane? And we end there.

And I was like, absolutely not. There’s no fucking way I’m going near a plane. At that time, I wouldn’t stay at hotels near airports. I didn’t go to an airport. I didn’t go to an airport for almost 20 years.

They weren’t even asking you to fly. They just wanted you to be near an airplane.

Yeah. They just wanted to have me walk on a plane, maybe insinuating maybe one day I’ll fly again. And that’s the end of the doc.

Contemplatively or something. Yeah.

What’d you say?

Contemplatively.

Yeah. And I was like, nah, that’s not what I’m going to do. So it just sat there stagnant. I call my manager. I was like, just put this out one day when I’m gone, whatever. I don’t want to deal with it anymore. Tell the guys I’m sorry, but I can’t finish it.

If this is how they want to finish it.

If that’s the ending. Yeah. I could never release a documentary with this thing that had such power over me. You know? Knowing I didn’t get on a plane again, and it still has this just complete power over me, where I’ll never fly again. So then I started thinking about it after I flew, which took 20 years, right?

Oh, so you didn’t even begin to revisit the documentary until —

No, it was dead to me.

— you got on a plane.

Yeah, it was dead to me. And I just had this documentary. I remember I had shared it with I think Bobby 100 from The 100s. And he was like, dude, that documentary is so good. And it wasn’t even finished then. And I think that sparked something in me because I also trust Bobby’s opinion. And he’s just great. And next thin you know, I fall in love, get into this relationship, start just doing a series of just self-work, doing breathwork, doing all this stuff. And I, very long story short, fly again.

Yeah. I mean, you’re alluding to this. The other thing that happened in between 2017 and 2026 is you married into the reality TV family. You had already done “Meet the Barkers,” and you end up with Kourtney Kardashian. You’re on “The Kardashians” last couple of seasons learning, I assume, to share more about your personal life in that format. Talk a little bit about how that process was, of opening up, and how it prepared you for this film of yours to really tell the end of that story, the second half of the movie.

I kind of don’t even realize I’m on the show, to be honest. I don’t watch —

We have news for you.

Yeah. I don’t watch the show. And I think the best way for me to deal with stuff like that, or to be a part of things like that, is to not really acknowledge that I’m being filmed or anything different’s happening. But I never even approve episodes or watch them.

Really? You don’t do any approvals?

No I’m not on the show as a main character, where I have interviews and I do whatever. I’m usually just — I’m an accessory.

You’re usually working out, honestly.

Really? Yeah.

You’re just taking care of the kids or exercising.

But the engagement is on the show.

Also, our wedding. Our wedding was filmed on iPhones.

She put a bunch of footage together for our wedding, which was really cool. And I did watch that with her. Obviously, that was awesome. But the show, it wasn’t really a learning curve to opening up or anything. I think what helped me release the documentary or even tap back into the documentary was being able to overcome the big things that had power over me.

Although, you talk about being on “Kardashians,” your fertility journey with your wife is documented on the show, but not entirely. And then in this film, in “Louder Than Fear,” you and Kourtney share the very harrowing story of a miscarriage that she had before you had your son Rocky, who’s now about two. How did you guys decide that this was the right forum to share that part of your journey together?

I think when there’s things that can benefit people or help people relate to something, I think that’s always a green light, especially — she’s always trying to do something like that. So our journey of miscarriages and then IVF, and it’s failed, resulting in us having a baby naturally, I feel like that’s a story —

That so many people can relate to.

— a million people can relate to because it’s a journey I’ve never been on.

Sure. But it’s an interesting choice then to put it in your film instead of on her show, I thought. You guys got a little deeper with the miscarriage specifically.

Yeah. The way the documentary happens is through a series of interviews. I’ll say something. And then they’re like, oh, well, tell me more about that. And that’s how that came up.

So you must have mentioned it.

So no one knew about that.

Right. It was something you were going through. You mentioned it in one of your interviews. And then they dug a little deeper. And Kourtney agreed to share her side of it in the film.

I’m also curious about something that comes up in maybe a slightly more tangential way. I was really struck by how your children spoke about fear and trauma and anxiety related to flying. And when you finally said, me and Kourtney, we’re going to get on a plane, and we’re going to go on this trip, that your children, Landon and Alabama, were saying, please don’t, please don’t, that that had been somehow transferred to them from your years of really struggling with it.

LOUDER THAN FEAR”^: When got here to inform us youngsters, we have been actually in opposition to it at first as a result of all we had recognized isn’t any. No flying. Don’t fly. Let’s not fly.

LOUDER THAN FEAR”^: He told us. He was like, yeah, I’m going to get on a plane. And we were like, fuck no, you’re not, because that’s all we knew growing up, was we’re never getting on a plane.

I wonder if you can talk about your conversations with them, talking them through your journey to hopefully get them comfortable with where you were at that time. Talk to me a little bit about that.

Yeah. Well, my kids were very, very protective of me and very scared, to the point where they were begging me not to go on the plane. So I had to show them to also break the cycle to where they would try it.

So they had never flown at that point.

Never.

And that was your choice.

Unfortunately, my kids were, I think, three and five, or somewhere around that age when my accident happened. And they never flew after that because I just — it’s sad, but they were basically brought up to think that’s how people die.

My journey getting there was — I remember I had this massage therapist that I would see while I was home. And I remember her telling me one day — she’s like, you got to do breathwork. And I’m like, what? What are you talking about? And she’s like, you have so much trauma. I can feel it in your body. Right?

And also, I don’t know. I didn’t know exactly how to navigate after my accident. Talked to a post-traumatic doctor, got sober, would run, would exercise, do all this stuff that I just felt was calling me. A fan that was really, really cool and very persistent would always reach out to me and be like, hey, do breathwork.

But the guy, he looked like me. He had tattoos on his head. His name is Lucas. He’s awesome.

Shout out to Lucas.

Yeah, Lucas is awesome.

Yeah, Lucas is doing the work.

And I was like, man, I feel so weird. I don’t know this person. I’m going to invite him in my home. I’m going to be very closed off. I’m going to try to control this situation a little bit. Dude, 10 minutes into it, I’m bawling my eyes out. I’m like a mess. And it’s like that the next five sessions.

But I also feel like I’m making progress. I just felt different. So ultimately, that led to me telling my wife, if you’re ever going to take me anywhere, don’t tell me about it. Just tell me the night before. So she did. I did breathwork the night before, ended up flying. Luckily, I had a great experience, right?

In parenting, I see your kids are very popular online.

You’ve had history in reality television and being a star yourself. How do you communicate with them about navigating that part of growing up? Because they’re growing up in a thing that you earned your way into. And then they’re growing up in it. They’re famous. The minute they turn on the phone, the minute they sign up for TikTok, they’re a well-known person.

It’s so hard. I mean, my son called me the other day. And he’s like, hey, they offered me to go on “The Voice.” And I was like, dude, you’re way too cool for that.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

I’m like, think of — what I always tell my kids and what I always tell myself — and I have to tell him because I’m like, also, son, you could think I’m being contradicting because you’ve seen me play drums on “American Idol” with Mary J. Blige or whatever. I’m like, I’m different. I’m a drummer, and I’m like — my flex is going from genre to genre, and this person and this person, and playing the Grammys with Lenny Kravitz and her. And then playing —

You’re like, I already did my cool — you got to earn some cred before you go on “The Voice.“.

I’m doing fun shit that’s just fun for me because I’m a drummer and I’m not on the forefront. It’d be different if I was singing with all these people. And I was like, you got to think about your idols. If your idol’s Kurt Cobain, would Kurt Cobain do “The Voice?” No. You know? And I know you’re in a rush to get to here, but take your time. It’s going to happen. I’m in the studio with them. I hear the songs that he’s creating. I’m like, there’s no rush. You know? Do things that are authentic to you.

Do you feel protective over how they present themselves on the internet? I mean, every now and then you see one of them get into some kind of scrap online. And I imagine as a parent, you’ve got to just be like, oh, no, how do I protect them from this? How do you navigate that part of the emergent young celebrity, especially in LA where it’s like everybody’s trying to make a name for themselves?

Yeah. Like Alabama, she’s in the mix, you know?

Yeah. I lead by example. I used to almost get in fights with paparazzis. You know what I mean? I was not proud of any of that stuff. I used to have a temper when it came to people following us, or just dumb stuff. Or if someone said something to me, I might be quick to react or be confrontational. But I’m like, that ain’t it, babe.

Like, all that, it’s just all noise. Don’t pay attention to any of it. Stay running in the direction you’re running in. Be happy. Try not to harm anybody or — just be good. Be a good person. But all I can do is — they’re adults. All my kids are adults. Like, Atiana is 27. Landon’s 22. Bama’s 20. I just try to love them and tell them, just stay in your own trajectory.

You ever come down hard on them? Do you ever have to pick up the phone and raise your voice?

I mean, yeah, of course.

Even though they’re adults.

Always respectfully, but yeah. Yeah, of course. You got to have —

Even the breathwork, sometimes you got to be Dad.

You got to have the hard conversations. No, I mean, I grew up — my dad was — he would whip my ass.

Yeah. That’s clear in the film, that you guys had a tough relationship, and that he was very hard on you. And there’s an extremely moving moment near the end. Spoiler, if you want to watch it yourself. But your dad is somebody who, as you said, was in the military.

He’s like, tattoos are for convicts. And you have a tattoo, Pal — nickname between you and your father. And then in the movie, he takes off his shirt, shows his sleeve. And I’m getting goosebumps thinking about it.

It’s a very powerful —

Then you see he’s got a matching one.

LOUDER THAN FEAR”^: One day I went, come right here, I bought one thing to indicate you.

And he stated, Dad, that’s a sticker. I stated, no, it’s not a sticker. I made a decision simply to indicate him I help him and all the things, that I’m going to go and I’m going to get that completed.

Talk to me about studying that and simply what that meant to you out of your father.

Yeah, full circle. I imply, I feel each dad or mum’s fear is that your youngsters are going to develop as much as be a fuckup, proper? So my dad advised me early on, you get a tattoo ever, I’m going to kick your ass. I’m going to kick you out of the home.

So I bought tattoos. I began tattooing my legs. But I might put on my socks up excessive so he wouldn’t see. And then as I bought older and I began — as soon as I left residence, it was a wrap. I feel the final tattoo I bought in the home was a memorial for my mother on my forearm. And he was actually upset about it. But it was additionally so significant to me to get a tattoo for my mother.

And then years later, my dad referred to as up one in all my tattoo artists that I had grown up with as a result of I bought a tattoo that claims “Pal” for him early on. And he went and bought it. And then he bought a well-known tattoo.

Oh, one other one.

Oh, he has —

He has the brand?

He has two tattoos. I’m like, pops —

He doesn’t present the opposite one.

— you’re loopy. Yeah. But, yeah, he’s identical to essentially the most supportive Dad I may ever ask for.

One extra query about parenting. One of the attention-grabbing issues about your marriage, your relationship with Kourtney, is you met a lot earlier as buddies and neighbors. You have been in Calabasas earlier than. You have been early on Calabasas earlier than it went loopy.

We have been there when there was — in Calabasas, within the neighborhood we lived in, there was one avenue. And I lived there with —

Wow, that’s unthinkable.

— my youngsters and my ex-wife.

Yeah. And so there’s some footage. I feel it’s interval footage, however of your youngsters and Kourtney’s youngsters earlier than you guys are collectively, possibly having a dinner or some form of play date or one thing. And I ponder, what have you ever realized about parenting from watching Kourtney and her youngsters? And what does she take from you in the way you elevate your youngsters? And I’m speaking about even pre-marriage, pre-dating, simply you guys as buddies, watching one another navigate that stage of maturity.

And then combining into what you guys consult with because the Brady Bunch.

But what do you study from one another about parenting earlier than you grew to become co-parents?

Yeah.

From the start, as soon as she had moved to the identical neighborhood as me, we might see one another round. We would work out on a regular basis. So naturally, our youngsters would hang around generally. So my youngsters have been a lot older. So I bear in mind, even to this present day, she may say one thing in regards to the older youngsters and even one thing to the impact the place I’ve to remind her — I’m like, it doesn’t matter in the event that they’re 5 or 11 or 13.

You’re not going to really feel any totally different about them after they’re 22, 20, or no matter age. It’s at all times the identical. You love them the identical method. It’s not like they immediately depart the home after they’re 18, and you cease caring about them. That’s by no means going to occur. I like my youngsters just like the day they have been born.

One of the final issues I needed to ask you about particularly from the doc — and for individuals who don’t know, I feel 2008 you have been getting back from a present on a non-public Learjet. And you have been with 5 different folks. Some of your closest buddies on the earth perished within the accident. DJ AM, one other shut pal of yours, died a brief time later.

And within the climax of the movie, as they’re going by means of this story and this footage, you’re drumming. And you’re basically doing an interpretive drum solo set to essentially the most horrible factor that’s ever occurred in your life. How was that directed? How was that made?

Yeah. Yeah, it was a little offsetting. The producer of the movie had stated, hey, there’s this scene within the movie the place we’re going to essentially go to among the footage of your airplane crash. And I need you to do a drum solo that form of mirrors that feeling.

So, yeah, confirmed as much as this warehouse that’s lit, all these folks in it. And there was fireplace in all places. And I didn’t say a lot. Honestly, I simply bought behind the equipment and began speaking.

With your fingers and your toes.

Yeah.

LOUDER THAN FEAR”]

And was that multiple takes? Is that just you —

It’s so raw It’s so cathartic and intense.

I think it’s like a two-piece. Yeah, I think I did two solos, which were just completely off the dome, just improv.

Yeah.

LOUDER THAN FEAR”]

That’s what got here out.

And you finish on your toes. When you have been completed, did you’re feeling such as you had launched one thing?

Yeah. It was just like the stroll away. You know if you see an MMA struggle, and you see somebody — they know knocked him out, and they don’t even want to look at him fall. They simply stroll off. I simply did a walk-off. I used to be like, I do know that’s it. But, yeah, that was exhausting, more durable than I communicated. But I simply thought the most effective factor was to simply put the vitality by means of the drums.

Did you fly to get right here?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Kind of a dangerous expertise. It’s humorous.

I’m sorry.

So flying is —

But thanks.

No, no, no, I’m so stoked to be right here. Flying is one thing that I do. But I feel I’ve discovered ways in which make it simpler for me to fly. And one in all them is I simply need to be on an Airbus. Right? I at all times learn all these horror tales about Boeings.

So I’m strolling within the airplane yesterday. And the flight crew was like, hey, do you need to say hello to the pilots? They needed to say hello. So I’m like, yeah, after all. I carry Rocky up there, say hello to the pilots. Pilots are tremendous cool. They requested if Rocky needs to take a seat within the chair or no matter.

And then he provides me this card that’s like the cardboard for the airplane you’re on. They’re like buying and selling playing cards, proper?

Yeah, I’ve examine this.

And it says Boeing 767. And I nearly fucking die.

And simply to be clear, you didn’t —

This is so aggravating.

— you didn’t crash in a Boeing. You simply see it within the information.

Yeah, I simply see it within the information. And I attempt to avoid non-public planes. They simply really feel just like the Wild West to me. I really feel so dangerous as a result of the pilot’s in all probability like, what’s fallacious with this man? And I stroll again to my seat. And I’m like, babe, that is a Boeing. We’re on a Boeing proper now.

And I’m so burdened as a result of I haven’t flown on one. And I feel I’ve these protocols that make me really feel a little safer to fly. And now we have essentially the most turbulent flight ever, the place the entire time he’s identical to, get in your seats, put your seatbelts on. And I’m identical to —

So it’s nonetheless a course of. It’s a journey each time.

Yeah. I do it. And I’ll at all times do it. I can nonetheless say I do have anxiousness in terms of flying. Sometimes I’m even — may take a name to my therapist, simply being like, hey, I’m going to fly, and simply stroll me by means of it, if I haven’t flown in a very long time.

I feel the extra I fly, so long as they’re good flights and nothing sketchy occurs, I get higher at it. But when there’s months and months with out flying, it does make it a little exhausting.

And this one, a tough one, doesn’t assist.

This one sucked.

I’m sorry. I’m getting on a airplane tonight. So now I’m like, uh.

No, I’m positive all the things was high-quality. My spouse’s simply chilling. Rocky’s additionally watching me. And he’s so cute and like, is it bumpy, Dad? And I’m like, oh, my God, It’s bumpy, son.

But two-year-olds can take the anxiousness out of a lot of conditions, proper? They simply pop the bubble.

Yeah. Yeah, it’s a blessing. Obviously, I affiliate it with one thing else.

Of course. Of course. Let’s hit a couple of questions on our lightning spherical.

Let’s go.

52 playing cards within the “Popcast” deck. Each one in all them corresponds to a pre-written query. Some of them are mild. Some of them are heavy.

Cool.

We’ll see the place. the destiny takes you right now. What do you bought? Ace of golf equipment.

Unbelievable. Everybody’s pulling actually apt playing cards. It’s good. OK, that is attention-grabbing, particularly as somebody who has been doing what you do because you have been a little one. What are you good at apart from what you do for a residing?

I’m fairly good at working.

Yeah.

I imply, it looks like it.

Yeah, it looks like it.

It was like —

What’s your marathon time? What’s your mile time, your marathon time proper now?

So I haven’t — I’m hitting a full marathon this 12 months. I hit a half marathon on Saturday. And I did it in an hour and 38 minutes.

Crazy.

So 7-20 mile. Yeah.

That’s aggressive, proper, for —

Yeah, nothing to stuff at.

40-something-year-old man who’s not a skilled runner.

I’m 50.

You’re 50?

Yeah, I’m 50. Yeah, I’m 50. But —

50 as effectively. Great age.

Yeah. It was one thing. Like after I discovered we have been having Landon, I simply left. I actually laced up my sneakers, and I ran to the freeway and again, which was like a six-mile —

You inform that story within the film.

— whole run. And it’s simply one thing DIY. I don’t want something. There’s no excuses. There’s no mendacity. There’s no faking it. I like working.

Oh, it’s humorous to listen to you body it as one thing DIY.

That’s cool. Running is punk.

Yeah, it’s punk.

Well, it’s. Yeah.

I’ve by no means heard it referred to that, however that’s very correct. It’s completely proper.

It could be very punk. We all have sneakers. We all have legs. We all can run. There’s no faking it. You know what I imply? There’s no straightforward strategy to do it. I adore it.

That’s nice.

Pull one other card.

DIY.

Ace of Spades.

It’s a magical pull.

Bon Iver, Justin Vernon, behind you, pulled a full home. That’s the most effective hand we’ve ever had.

Yeah. So we’ll see how right now goes. Maybe you’ll pull 4 aces. OK, Ace of Spades. What did your mother and father not train you that you simply want that that they had taught you?

Maybe like cash, like about funds and stuff. I are inclined to hearken to a lot of podcasts about cash and simply no matter —

Personal finance kind stuff?

Everything. Yeah. But we additionally didn’t have any. So yeah, it was like one thing I —

They couldn’t have ready you on your life.

Yeah, it was one thing I needed to study. I bear in mind my first chunk of cash I made. Actually, from the Blink exhibits, my first three Blink exhibits, I went residence and I purchased a Cadillac.

Like proper off rack, simply money?

Like a low rider?

Yeah. Well, a ‘66 Cadillac. And I remember my tour manager, Stuart. Rest in peace. He came to my house. He’s like, bro, you’re like hood wealthy. You have a bunch of old fashioned vehicles, and you’re renting a home together with your three homies. Sell your vehicles and purchase a fucking home. And I did. I purchased a home, and then I form of began over.

Amazing. That’s nice.

Did you get one other ‘66 Cadillac?

Of course. Of course.

Great news. Great news. Great. [LAUGHS]

Hit another card.

Queens.

Queen of Spades.

Queen of Spades. OK, well, this is an apt question that we touched on. On a long flight, what do you do? Are you distracting yourself? Are you watching a movie?

Can’t consider you pulled a flying query.

It’s unbelievable you pulled this query. You working towards? What do you do?

Yeah. I imply, folks will hate me If I’m working towards on the airplane. So I don’t try this. Usually, I’ll attempt to watch one thing. I don’t watch TV at residence. I’m normally on the studio actually lengthy hours. And I simply come residence to sleep.

Yeah, positive.

And then after I’m residence, I’ve seven youngsters.

Got a lot to concentrate to, yeah.

So, yeah, my time is —

Accounted for.

Yeah. I like spending time with them. So no TV at residence. So I’ll catch up on stuff.

Sure.

Hit two extra and get your self a hand, and then we’ll eat a snack.

King.

King of Hearts.

King of Hearts.

Where do your finest concepts come to you?

They can come to me all types — generally proper earlier than I fall asleep, I’ll consider one thing. Sometimes the bathe. Sometimes on a run. I’m ending up the Alkaline Trio album proper now.

Oh, good.

And one thing will come to me after I’m on a run. And then I’ll simply dart to the studio and hurry up and get the concept out. Yeah, they actually come to me after I’m doing something however sitting within the studio. It’s the most effective.

Trying to think about one thing.

I can also’t hearken to something I work on within the studio. It must be displaced. I must be doing one thing, driving, one thing like that.

All these issues that you simply’re describing, there’s a mono focus if you’re doing — it clears out all of the muddle, which in all probability then permits room for one thing to simply pop in and have freedom. Yeah.

Totally.

So you bought the documentary, the alkaline trio album. What else do you’ve gotten developing?

Starting a couple different initiatives, like producing initiatives, working on the subsequent Blink album.

Nice.

Yeah.

This 12 months, subsequent 12 months, what do you suppose for Blink?

We’re working on the Blink album this 12 months.

Yeah, nice.

Great.

All proper, pull yet another.

What will we bought?

Seven of Spades.

Seven of Spades. Do you learn your individual DMs?

Yeah.

Yeah?

Yeah.

Do you go loopy within the further mailboxes, the wild stuff?

The hidden messages?

Not actually.

Just the principle one.

Blue checks solely, and Lucas.

Yeah, Lucas. I might have by no means discovered Lucas. I’m telling you guys, he’s wonderful. And breathwork’s wonderful. Yeah. No, I imply, there’s sure folks I solely talk with.

Via DM.

Yeah.

If you collaborate with rappers, it’s a must to learn your DMs.

That’s the rule. Yeah.

Yeah, completely.

Yeah.

It simply is what it’s.

I even have a pal like Atiba that I’ve recognized for years, who’s like a photographer. He did all my Van stuff.

Sure, Atiba Jefferson.

Yeah, yeah. And we solely talk by means of DM. It’s so humorous.

Even although you’ve recognized one another ceaselessly, yeah.

Yeah, though I see him. And I don’t know why. But it’s simply our method of speaking.

That’s humorous.

Yeah, I’ve a Van — I’ve a shoe popping out too.

You’ve completed different clothes issues. Obviously, you had your model for a very long time. Doing a Vans, clearly, I think about very particular as somebody who grew up within the punk scene.

Yeah, Vans is large.

You’re rocking your Vans tonight.

Yeah, watching the Circle Jerks and Descendents and rising up skateboarding and using BMX, to have signature sneakers with Vans is like —

You’re a skate low, skate excessive, a half cab.

I did two previous faculties. And then I’ve an genuine popping out subsequent 12 months too.

Nice.

Yeah.

We’re going to have snack. I need to discuss to you about garments whereas now we have a snack.

Every episode of “Popcast” ends with a snack take a look at. You are a very wholesome man. You eat vegan. You eat natural. You eat gluten-free.

We don’t, however —

We don’t. But we’re going on this journey with you.

Awesome.

Producer Kate went out and bought some particular Travis Barker-approved snacks. You eyed these. You stated each now and then you’ve gotten a Sour Patch Kid?

Oh, I like Sour Patch Kids.

And they’re vegan.

Sometimes in the course of the exhibits, I’ll simply have a couple Sour Patch Kids. No, if you happen to want sugar or if Mark and Tom are going on a lengthy rant —

Right. You’re like, time to eat some sweet.

[LAUGHS] I like the concept of them simply yammering on the crowd. And you’re simply popping Sour Patch Kids behind them.

So these are Sour Diamond tutti frutti Bubs. I by no means had a Bubs.

What even class of snack is that this?

It’s a gummy. It’s a bitter gummy.

It’s a gummy. It’s not like a crack — OK. All proper.

It’s a gluten-free, vegan bitter gummy. Oh, Swedish. We treasure our Swedish heritage, and we’re captivated with making wonderful mouthwatering sweet. These look good. We’re going to style one. We’re going to rank it out of 10. And then you definitely’re going to be on your method.

Cool.

And whereas we’re doing that, model has at all times been — like, It’s very clear.

That’s good.

It tastes like surf wax or one thing.

You need to seize a couple —

Right?

You need to seize a couple extra?

[LAUGHS]

Yeah, I’ll have one other one.

They’re very bitter.

They’re so good.

They’re actually good.

Is this a Pendleton we’re sporting right now, or is that this —

Oh, it’s simply a flannel. Yeah.

Tell me a little bit about arriving at your look as a result of you’ve gotten a very signature look. And additionally, how exhausting is it to get fairly priced band t-shirts anymore now that the market is an absolute nightmare?

Oh, it’s insane.

These are scrumptious.

Yeah, these are so good.

Oh, my God.

I may crush that bag.

They’re additionally a little mallow-y. There’s a little marshmallow.

Yeah, it’s actually good.

Like, it’s not a gummy within the heavy sense. Oh, my God.

People are sleeping on these. I’ve by no means even heard of them.

Bubs about to go method up after this.

Buy inventory. Have some extra.

Not spon.

They’re so good.

This will not be a sponsor. We simply found some nice gummies.

But inform me about creating your private model, which i do know looks like a foolish factor to speak about. But additionally, the band t-shirt factor is actual. I imply, you’re a man. Whether it’s on your previous TV present or simply seeing footage of you, you put on good [MUTED].

Well, thanks.

But it’s more and more exhausting to seek out. It’s extremely costly now.

Now it’s insane. AM and I liked classic from the soar. We’d at all times purchase classic and commerce stuff with one another. And actually, they have been simply not boxy and exhausting t-shirts. They simply felt good, particularly for enjoying drums and at all times shifting. Yeah, it felt good. And it’s the identical motive I gather old fashioned vehicles or old fashioned BMX bikes or old fashioned skateboards. It brings again my childhood, issues that I like that really feel like residence for me. And then my private model, grew up in Dickies and Vans.

Were you sporting some superior post-Dickies right here, with the seam entering into a wild course?

Yeah, there’s some undercover ones.

I used to be guessing it was undercover. Yeah.

But, yeah, not a lot. I imply, I grew up sporting Docks and monkey boots as a child skateboarding and stuff. But I attempt to avoid leather-based as a result of I’m vegan. And, yeah, as soon as in a whereas I’ll put on a flannel or one thing if I really feel like I need to be presentable. I’m coming to “New York Times Popcast.” I don’t need to look —

You don’t bought to decorate up.

I don’t need to appear to be a bum, ?

Honestly, we’re

Some folks may go extra bummy. And then some folks may go nicer. It relies upon on —

I feel I’m proper within the center.

This is nice.

But I’ve no downside sporting a go well with and proudly owning it. I like cleansing up too, if it’s referred to as for.

Yeah. You guys look nice on the wedding ceremony, clearly. It was Dolced out, proper?

Yeah.

And for the shirts, are you doing showroom procuring, or are stylists bringing you piles of hardcore shirts? Then they’re identical to, these are yours now.

No. I’ll simply search eBay.

Oh, so that you’re a —

All I do is — it’s like, search classic tee shirts, Chevy Impalas.

Oh, you a purchase a automotive on Ebay?

Chevy Suburbans.

Will you purchase the precise automotive on eBay?

I’ll be on Barrett-Jackson or Mecum.

They’ll carry a trailer or one thing like that.

Bring a trailer. Hemmings.

Love it.

I respect an internet shopper. Great stuff.

Yeah, I adore it.

These gummies, 9 out of 10.

They’re 9.

Yeah, 9 out of 10.

Not like — a simple 9.

An straightforward 9, possibly a 9 and 1/2.

Yeah, I’m startled. I’m not ready. I’m a vegan now.

Yes.

And you like bitter sweet.

Yeah.

Sweden.

Swedish bitter candies.

I’m a Swedish vegan.

You guys are so humorous. My son, he’ll be like, is that actual cheese or is it vegan? I’m like, son, vegan cheese is actual. It’s simply actually wholesome. I used to be making an attempt to inform him.

[LAUGHS]

It does exist. It is actual. Yeah.

So humorous.

Travis Barker, thanks a lot for being right here with us right now.

Thank you guys.

This was wonderful.

What a pleasure to have you ever. I respect you being right here and sharing all these tales with us. Every episode of “Popcast” ever is at nytimes.com/popcast. We’re on YouTube at youtube.com/popcast, Instagram, TikTook. You know the place to seek out us. We’ll be again subsequent week. Credits and hyperlink in bio.

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